![]() The Great Fisherpeople & the Big Bass words from an intentional life |
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And it is further true amongst all those who claim leadership by virtue of divine authority we may apply this test with authority - that the man who stands for humanity, first, last and all the time, against all vested interest, religious and economic, is the man who stands as Jesus stood. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
posted by: mimi (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (6:00 pm) as in fishing, i believe in "catch and release"...catch the wonders and release to those around you! posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (6:24 pm) Reply to: mimi Hey, that's an awesome addition/improvement on this theme. Ima gonna steal it and use later :-) posted by: mimi (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (6:33 pm) Reply to: kurtmaddox you have my blessing...i know you will make good use of it : ) glad to have you back here blogging with us again...we need all the inspiration we can get : ) xoxo posted by: surrogate (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (6:56 pm) I give this post three gills up. posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (7:04 pm) Reply to: surrogate I just read it for the first time since typing it and posting it -- boy do I need an editor! lol! Still, "3 Gills", huh? I'll take that anyday. Thanks! posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.02.08 (7:04 pm) Reply to: mimi Heck, that's a good deal -- I get to steal your ideas AND get your blessing? I must be livin right ;-) posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (5:32 am) as Viktor Frankl says (paraphrasing) "it's not what happens to you in your life, but your RESPONSE to what happens to you which defines the person..." LOL posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (8:51 am) Reply to: fractalmom True enough. Still, the framework from which a person RESPONDS often largely limits that person's available responses. There is literally no end the examples where a persons irrational beliefs might box them into a false set of choices when RESPONDING to a particular thing that might have "happened" to the them. Certainly, there's nothing in my Parable of the Great Fisherpeople that is incompatible with Frankl's quote. So, I'm curious why the added "LOL" to your comment. I'm trying to figure out how that point is funny? lol :-) Please clue in the clueless! (What's the abbreviation for a light-hearted grin?) :-) posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (11:18 am) Reply to: kurtmaddox hmmm. the LOL i think was mostly due to the joining of comparisons and fishing. but i do think that frankl makes a valid point, and that it doesn't matter WHAT frame of reference your life has given you, it still comes down to your responses to the things that happen. even within the framework limited by say, extreme conservative judeochristian fundamentalism, you are still ABLE to respond in a humane manner. you may not CHOOSE to do so, but that just proves frankl right. posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (11:50 am) Reply to: fractalmom Sure, but, isn't there a difference between my personal responsibility to make the best of any given situation using the best response I can muster and our equally individual responsibility to attempt to get at what the truth is about a given subject so that we all have a great opportunity to respond in ways that correspond as well as possible to a given situation? For example, is it a rational philosophy to tell someone who has been give very harmful medical treatment that the person should just be concerned about their "response" and not about discovering what the proper medical treatment should have been so that they can find the best possible solution to their ailment? There is no doubt that personal responsibility is a core value. However, to answer everything societal issue with the bromide "if it's to be, it's up to me" doesn't seem very rational to me. Also, isn't changing ones paradigm of seeing the world to a view that best matches the available evidence a part of "personal responsibility"? Frankl made important contributions and I don't know of many folks who would disagree with the simple bit of wisdom contained in his "choosing your response" insights. Many others have made the same suggestions. Dr. Stephen Covey developed Frankl's insight and other similar insights into a whole philosophy of effectiveness called "The 7 Habits". The American ideal that I cherish is built upon the concept of allowing citizens the greatest possible freedom in how they make their personal choices. However, none of this has a thing to do with whether or not something is demonstrably "true" or demonstrably "false". My central point is that in order to catch fish, you need be willing to get out of bed and go down to the river and do the work AND it is very helpful if you know where the fish are and what helps you catch them. I've read Frankl extensively and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't take issue with that extension of his "choosing your response" mantra. So, I think it very much DOES matter "what frame of reference your life has given you" and I think it can often be a critica determinant of how one's life goes. Excellent addition and comment! I really appreciate you making it :-) posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (6:54 pm) Reply to: kurtmaddox dude. i'm gonna leave this one till tomorrow morning ROFL. it's 9:50 pm, I just got all three Pint's to bed finally, and REALLY need to drink this nice Shiraz, and go veg out in front of the tv for an hour or so..... but, i cannot wait till tomorrow morning!! posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (8:44 pm) Reply to: fractalmom Shiraz goes great with Bass :-) posted by: bipolarexpress (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (8:47 pm) is this you or is this paster dave?? posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (8:50 pm) Reply to: bipolarexpress No, this is certainly me! lol! Can't an open-minded humanist also be spiritual? Pastor Dave and I actually have much more in common that it would appear on the surface. I think he knows that and it is what helps him not want to kill me as much as might want to otherwise! Ha! Ha! posted by: bipolarexpress (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (9:20 pm) Reply to: kurtmaddox I meant cause of your comments in tblurt where the 2 of you were going to change blogs..lol it was a joke ;-} posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.03.08 (10:11 pm) Reply to: bipolarexpress Got it... I'm a bit dense sometimes :-) posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.04.08 (6:32 am) Reply to: kurtmaddox Okay. Deep breath. Drink of Coffee. Kids on bus. 3/4 Pint safely ensconced in Pap's recliner watching the new Alvin and the Chipmunks movie with her Dad (Cop) who is visiting. Now. Of course, there is a BIG difference between personal responsibility and individual responsibility while within a societal structure. Since we do not live in a perfect society, however, no matter how much we both wish we did....we are given great opportunities on a daily, sometimes hourly basis to allow ourselves to make personal and responsible choices, most of which we fail at miserably. To answer the ills of society with Frankl's theory of happiness would be at best, ludicrous, and at worst, LOL, irresponsible. And yes, the great dichotomy here is that we, in general, and as a society, do NOT allow our sense, (or lack thereof) of personal responsibility and choosing strategies to cross over into our more public endeavors. There are a few 'philanthropists' in fact, who DO that. And, I am very jealous of their ability to do that. I highly respect their ability to do that, as well as use their more than considerable resources to make our world a better place. My basic premise is that if all people, (i know, how idealistic can a person be??) take the time, the thought and the effort to understand that each and every choice you make in your day to day life can have effects on other people, then perhaps there would be less deleterious effects? A bit far fetched, I know. That's what happens when you start out a bare-footed hippie from the Haight and end up a conservative in Ohio some 40 years later LOL. The philosophy behind fishing, or star gazing, or simply sitting on a big rock in a beautiful setting, with a poem in your head, or a piece of bait on your line, appreciating the beauty of the things around you....is the one we should keep with us daily. Unfortunately, life intrudes in chaotic and loud and vicious ways. And THAT is when our basic and core philosophy of response to any given situation kicks in. While Covey did develop the system for 7 habits, when I read it, I thought it was geared mostly toward the road to personal success, with a definite cant towards business success. Something I have never been able to get LOL. I am totally a right brainer, and cannot (now HERE is a shock ;) interact well with other humans for the most part. So, I do make the mistake of reading over quickly those parts of things which speak to improving my business skills, since I neither have, nor want any of those. Tacky of me, I know. The frame of reference that each of us carries does become pertinent, and the way we look at the process of achieving our goals is paramount to the success of achieving our goals. But, regardless of the frame of reference, our RESPONSES to each and every situation we encounter, still, ultimately, defines who and what we become. Regardless of our 'frame of reference'. Some may go on to achieve greatness, others will be held back by their particular 'frame', but that is a self limiting thing I believe. Of course, you should always be proactive in any endeavor, whether it be lusting after a fat bass, or ending world hunger. What you put into any effort is going to match, pretty well, and for the MOST part, what you get out of said effort. The only problem with Frankl, Covey and any of the others of the same ilk, is that the entire world won't subscribe to it LOL. If we ALL did, we would achieve utopia. Till then, you will enjoy the philosophy of fishing, I will enjoy the philosophy of talking to a five year old, and we shall remain on our own quests for self improvement, while we attempt to make the world a better place through understanding and compassion, and watching our responses to any given situation. posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.04.08 (4:58 pm) Reply to: fractalmom That is a really great response and some excellent points. I like how you are able to relate personal experiences to philosophical or idealogicial points and still not discount the theory just because your experience might be a bit differnt. Theories are like hats - you pick those that seem to fit best and you wear them around awhile to see what happens. If good things happen, you usually want to wear those hats as often as possible. Good points on Covey and other gurus -- I think they'd agree with you on the "utopian" versus the daily reality issue. Still, we take what we can from those from whom we can learn something, we integrate the learning and we go on to making our unique contribution while continually making adjustments as we go. Just a really thoughtful comment and I appreciate your willingness to contribute to the conversation! posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.05.08 (6:08 am) Reply to: kurtmaddox why thank you sir!! A few other things occurred to me. Do you remember the last book of the super series "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy"..called "mostly harmless"? Hopefully you do or this comment will be totally meaningless. Arthur Dent, having been stranded on a world (after traveling and saving the universe a number of times in the previous four books) where they worshiped the 'almighty bob', had finally and completely found inner, as well as outer peace. He had become the 'great sandwich maker' and was respected, revered and sought after by his fellow inhabitants. He took great joy in working with the blacksmith to develop the 'perfect meat slicing knife, as well as the perfect bread slicing knife'. He enjoyed the construction of the sandwich, the presentation of the sandwich, and the end result of the sandwich which became to him, the culmination of seeing HIS particular (and sought after) creation actually feeding, and keeping happy, the populous. See, that is what happens when you cut your baby teeth on Kant, Frankl, Aristotle, Asimov, Sartre, Kierkeguaard, Hegel and Nietzsche, then you end up finding Douglas Adams ROFLMAO. You sort of incorporate, as we spoke of previously, all that you have read up to that point, and then you add in a 'new' view..... And you end up like me !! The character Arthur Dent LOVED being on the world where Bob was worshipped. Arthur Dent was blissfully happy being the honored and respected sandwich maker. Arthur Dent was content. He didn't care if the rest of the world went to hell or not, as long as he was able to make and perfect his sandwiches. Arthur is that person inside each and every one of us that sits idly by and watches horrors happen. Arthur Dent is our comfort zone. Yet, when Ford Prefect comes and grabs him existentially by the balls and says "the world as we know it is about to end!!" Arthur, still in his bathrobe, once again pulls himself out of his comfort zone, and goes off, yet again, to save the universe. Poor Arthur!! He already knows that the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything is 42. He has found out that the REAL problem was that no one knew the QUESTION. He found out the QUESTION, which was "What do you get when you multiply 6 x 9?" which of course, is 42. And, fundamentally is why our universe does NOT make sense. It was supposed to be 42, but we are just that much off kilter, and so, we THINK that 6 x 9 = 54, thereby throwing everything just slightly off and making it all NOT make any sense whatsoever. Then, you find that you can achieve an almost total and complete lack of understanding of the universe. And, further, you find that it is okay. You reach the moment when you accept that there are simply things which will never make sense, are not supposed to make sense, and if they did make sense, you would spontaneously disappear in a cloud of understanding and cease to be. And you, like Arthur Dent, are content to be the absolute BEST that you can be at what you CAN do. And, also like Arthur Dent, when someone comes along and grabs you up, you rise to the occasion, contributing whatever expertise you have gained along the way, and you run off in your bathrobe to do whatever YOU can to help. That's pretty much where I am now. RIP Doug. posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.05.08 (9:50 am) Reply to: fractalmom I happend to know for a fact that 6 x 9 is NOT 42 or 54, but, is indeed, 17. I knew this by age 18 and that knowledge is responsible for a lifetime of having live with the horrible reality that I'm really the only person on this planet that knows what I'm talking about on any subject since I'm the only human being who can possibly be starting with a true "a priori" fact. A is NOT A... A is 17. Even "NON 17 is 17"! That absolutely BLEW my mind! (As you can imagine.) Like Arthur Dent, I'm willing to save the universe if it really gets in a pinch. I am, however, content for now to just write this blog, raise my kids, do my job, marry the love of my life and mess with those who are so certain they know all the answers when clearly they don't. (17 and all that.) Ever so often, someone leaves a comment that causes me suspect they are cut from the same chunk of primordial ooze as me. So, than 17 there are at least a few of your kind out there helping me not feel so much existential angst about how things are looking for humankind on the surface of things. There are times when 17 seems more a curse than a blessing! posted by: fractalmom (reply) post date: 04.05.08 (5:29 pm) Reply to: kurtmaddox ahhhh, she replied, nodding sagely... thinking to herself ("i KNEW he was one of those 17'ers......") posted by: Sis (reply) post date: 04.08.08 (7:34 am) Oh Dear Brother, don't you know the answer to everything in life is "42"? posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.08.08 (4:11 pm) Reply to: Sis Nope, it is definitely "17" -- I've been given special gnosis of this from very good authority! posted by: Sis (reply) post date: 04.09.08 (6:40 am) Well no one consulted me on this change? Story of my life ;) posted by: sebastianjoshua (reply) post date: 04.16.08 (6:29 pm) oh wow... fishing did i miss the boat... lol smile always :-) posted by: kurtmaddox (reply) post date: 04.17.08 (9:03 am) Reply to: sebastianjoshua boy did you ;-) |
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